Jump to content


Photo

What to do with a 6 week old. Getting 6 hours of broken sleep a day. I'm desperate.


  • Please log in to reply
86 replies to this topic

#16 beckabunny

beckabunny

    Centurion

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,405 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 09:53 AM

I'm sorry to say it but some babies are just shocking sleepers. Alex was terrible, he would sleep for 20 mins at a time at most between feeds during the day and maybe up to an hour at night and when he was awake he was unsettled, he wouldn't cry, he would literally scream and scream and scream. He was a bad feeder too so we had to take him off the breast and things improved a little and we got up to 40 mins sleep during the day and a little over an hour at night. I took him to every damn doctor and specialist I could think of but they had no idea what was wrong and I always got told "babies cry dear, what did you expect?"

Finally at 3.5 months old we got in to 'sleep school' (Queen Elizabeth Centre) and they taught him and me controlled crying. It tore me up inside to do it but I was already depressed and borderline psychotic from 3.5 months of *^%$ all sleep so I was forced to go with it. The CC worked and by 5 months old he was going 6 hour sleeps over night and a good sleep between each feed during the day (I can't really remember how long but I think it was 1.5 hours)

Sleep school might be a good idea, but, I'm unsure how long you're leaving him unattended for if he's not crying, but not sleeping. If you go in too frequently, you could be the reason why he's not going to sleep because the smell of you being near would alert him back up again. It sounds like you may need to just leave him be for a bit longer and trust that he will sleep (unless he is actually sounding distressed).

Beck
IPB Image

My idea of heaven

#17 em2007

em2007

    chocoholic

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,695 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 10:10 AM

He sounds very overstimulated. I agree if he is relatively settled but just not sleeping it's unlikely to be reflux. Will had reflux but the bigger problem with his sleeping was that overstimulation (in hindsight!).

He's now in a routine of stayin awake and that is going to be hard to break. I am all for demand feeding and babyled routine - but I found that once you got all out of sync the only way to get back in sync was to start a mummy led routine as it's hard to read the cues from a 6 week old baby who is SO overtired.

I think anything you do is not going to make overnight changes. So firstly, be prepared for that. If a night nanny lets you get some sleep you will be much better equipped to handle making some changes.

FWIW - I NEVER planned on CIO/CC but Will did not go to sleep with us cuddling/rocking etc. It all just increased his alertness and he became more upset. We spent months where every sleep took an hour of him screaming in our arms and then he would sleep for half an hour. It's destroying.

Things improved when I gave up and left him. I figured he was screaming the house down in my arms - it couldn't be worse in the cot. He still cried but there was less fight in the screams and he settled quicker. Within a week or so he had changed to grizzling himself to sleep and then his sleeps grew longer.

Call all the sleep schools and cry. I waited a while with Angus at 8 months because I sounded like I had it all together (I didn't!) and a friend who was having less problems burst into tears and got in very quickly!

If you have private health insurance - go to a private mother/baby unit? Even if all you get is rest (and DH gets sleep) it will still help!



#18 Kerala

Kerala

    Frequent Poster

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 629 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:27 AM

Would a sling / baby bjorn / ergo / manduca work? Just wondering if that might help remove some of the overtiredness and help things along? The movement and closeness to you might help lull him off for a period during the day, at some point when he is more rested you can start other patterns?

I really feel for you. No sleep is absolutely terrible....

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb2f.lilypie....om/ZBmcp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Second Birthday tickers" /></a>

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lbdf.lilypie....om/tIvCp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Pregnancy tickers" /></a>

#19 kisma

kisma

    Part of the Furniture

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,649 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:44 AM

Aww that sounds terrible for the three of you LJM. I agree about getting something along the lines of Ergo Cocoon or.....ahhh cant remember the names. DD wet through both of hers last night and is currently not sleeping because she wont stay wrapped up and they are still drying. Once you like one get at least 3.

You could also try Brauers colic releif, there is a sleep one too but I think maybe its only recommended from 2 years? I cant look as DS is asleep and its in his room. Infants friend is good, I have used that for both bubs and find it can work well (both had BAD wind).

And if you can get someone to look after him (or the night nanny) do it, you will certainly be able to think clearer and be less stressed/upset/ and everything else when you have had some decent sleep. I cant beleive you mum.

If you dont have them maybe try and find a second hand/hire one but a swing or a vibrating rocker. My daughter would love the swing but I havent bought one and goes to sleep in the rocker with/without the vibrate on.

Best of luck.
<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb2f.lilypie....om/uBccp11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Second Birthday tickers" /></a>

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb1f.lilypie....om/d45Kp11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie First Birthday tickers" /></a>

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lbdf.lilypie....om/S5yfp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Pregnancy tickers" /></a>

#20 kisma

kisma

    Part of the Furniture

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,649 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:58 AM

Another thought is a chiropractor, from memory Leo was vacuumed out? So his neck, shoulders, back etc coud be out a little. And I read heaps of positive things about them when DS was little but never got around to taking him to one when we moved towns. Could be worth a try.
<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb2f.lilypie....om/uBccp11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Second Birthday tickers" /></a>

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb1f.lilypie....om/d45Kp11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie First Birthday tickers" /></a>

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lbdf.lilypie....om/S5yfp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Pregnancy tickers" /></a>

#21 Monica

Monica

    Part of the Furniture

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,128 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 01:28 PM

You poor thing!
I can’t really offer any advice but perhaps a helping hand? I am happy to come to wherever you are (I think you are in Sydney) and take Leo out for a long walk in the pram so you can get some rest?
I know it’s not a long term solution but the offer is always there, please don’t be too proud to ask if you need it.

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb5f.lilypie....om/511Hp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Fifth Birthday tickers" /></a>

#22 Channy

Channy

    Dealing with life's curve balls

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,811 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 01:34 PM

Big hugs to you, I can very much understand.

Aidan started out sleeping quite well for the first 2 weeks and then he became very unsettled. Very hard to get to sleep during the day, hours of rocking, patting, white noise, no noise, prams, car trips.

Lots of crying from him and me.

I was at my wits end when he was about 8 weeks old and applied to get into Ellen Barron (sleep school in Brisbane). I was declined. I was devastated.

Some days he would cry almost all day. Feeding was a nightmare. He would go on/off the breast, beat my chest with his fists. Nothing worked.

I cracking up. I was loosing weight rapidly, not sleeping. DH and I were fighting. DH fell asleep at the lights one morning driving to work.

Desperate I went back to the GP when Aidan was around 3 months and I had not slept for 2 days. I had developed insomnia. I was admitted to a post natal ward the next day.

I had developed horrible anxiety and it had effected my breast milk supply. Aidan was hungry, very hungry, he had stopped gaining weight and was doing green splat poos. I made the decision to switch to formula and that night he slept. 12 hours. He stopped crying all day. He started sleeping..alot. I had been so adament to BF, I had guilt at first, but once I saw such a radical change in my baby, I knew it was the best thing I did and I still do. It took me a few weeks and a variety of medications to get myself right, back to sleeping.

Are you able to find a sympathetic GP or child nurse and talk to them about sleep issues? I was brushed off by a few ECHNs, but try to persist and find someone who will listen.

In the meantime, do you have any family close by? I didn't, but if you do, can you leave baby with them for a few hours, armed with expressed milk or formula. Then you and Hubby can sleep. Try not to feel guilty, please do it for your own sakes.

Sleep deprivation is horrible. As you can see by my story, it can lead to all sorts of things.

In Qld there are daystays, where you go to a Qld Health facility for a day and a early childhood nurse helps you with feeding, sleep & settling. I did this just before I was admitted and it was beneficial. Try to use these resources.

Please let us know how you get on.

Chantelle & Karl
28th August 2004


<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb1f.lilypie....om/512pp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie First Birthday tickers" /></a>

Aidan Erich 20 Dec 08
Tabitha Alexandra 18 Jan 13
Maximilian 10 Feb 11 (RIP)
& 3 other little stars watching over us

#23 nephthys

nephthys

    Nothing worth having is easy.

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,374 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 02:33 PM

Big hugs gorgeous girl. I've got two horrid sleepers and know exactly what you're going through, even the complete lack of support network. Last night it was five hours of broken sleep, but I know it's still more than you get. It's incredible how precious you can get over sleep; I nearly left my husband over it.

With DS2, I co-sleep. I've had no choice because he had undiagnosed silent reflux (until three weeks ago) and was awake every hour. I prop myself up a bit on pillows and sleep him tummy-down on my chest. That way he's head is up a little and has mummy for comfort. I know it goes against SIDS guidelines so I'm not going to recommend it, I'm just telling you what I've done.

I second getting him checked out for silent reflux. Here is a link showing the symptoms: http://www.reflux.or...=1:article-text This link says that a child may not necessarily cry with reflux...

xxxx
{Insert witty line/ticker/photo here}

#24 la_jeune_mariée

la_jeune_mariée

    Turning paychecks into wine.

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,494 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 02:53 PM

Channy that's awful! I'm terrified that's where we'll end up. Ive started to get overtired myself and am struggling to drop off between feeds even when Sam has him. It's more frustrating than when he's screaming at me.

We've tried formula and it's had no impact but we agreed to give it another try tonight immediately after his feed to see if both together make a difference. I've got plenty of milk for the first time since he was born and I don't want to mess with supply if I can avoid it.

I felt completely disheartened when the GP wrote me off. My husband also keeps telling people things are great like he's Pollyanna and it makes me want to kill him. It completely invalidates my experience. He might be coping but he's getting far more sleep than me. He baulked at the idea of a night nurse making me especially glad I kept a stash of my own cash when I went on mat leave. If he's not with me, he can just get out of my way. I've had it and i really don't want to end up where you did.

QUOTE(kisma @ Jan 5 2012, 12:58 PM) View Post

Another thought is a chiropractor, from memory Leo was vacuumed out? So his neck, shoulders, back etc coud be out a little. And I read heaps of positive things about them when DS was little but never got around to taking him to one when we moved towns. Could be worth a try.


He has torticollis and a sternocleidomastoid tumor from his position in the womb and the vacuum. My cousins baby had the same thing and she mentioned taking baby to a chiro who fixed her up and improved her sleep as an unexpected side effect. I'd completely forgotten about it. Husband won't be keen but he can suffer in his jocks as far as I'm concerned wink.gif We have him in physio anyway and the physio is no more qualified than a good chiro. Will give it a try.

QUOTE(Monica @ Jan 5 2012, 02:28 PM) View Post

You poor thing!
I can’t really offer any advice but perhaps a helping hand? I am happy to come to wherever you are (I think you are in Sydney) and take Leo out for a long walk in the pram so you can get some rest?
I know it’s not a long term solution but the offer is always there, please don’t be too proud to ask if you need it.


Oh Monica you're lovely. wub.gif It's thoughtful of you to offer.
"The less justified a man is in claiming excellence for his own self, the more ready he is to claim excellence for his nation, his religion, his race or his holy cause." - Eric Hoffer


#25 SEA

SEA

    Part of the Furniture

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,744 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 03:16 PM

Massive hugs, S.

C has silent reflux, and didn't start her screaming until about six weeks. Does he get lots of hiccups? That can often be a sign. She also refuses to sleep if there is even one tiny bit of wind.

YouTube Dunstan Baby Language and have a look at the different noises they make. 'Eh' is a windy noise, 'Na' is hungry, and 'Waa' is uncomfortable. It might seem a bit bogus, but it helped me recognise what both H and C were trying to 'tell' me.

I also agree with the tight wrapping. Big W have some great cotton waffle wraps in their Dymples brand. They're about $12 for 2 and I swear by them. You can wrap bub really tightly, and it's hard for them to Houdini out.

Watching for tired signs is really useful - C is 12 weeks and she only last a max of 90 mins before she's ready for bed again. I feed, change her, quick play, then wrap and sleep. I mainly cuddle her to sleep - she was self settling until she got reflux.

I have a book called The No Cry Sleep Solution I'm more than happy to lend you if you like? I can post it tomorrow if you would like it. If you ever want to chat just PM for my number - even a text in the middle of the night can make you feel less alone. Being a mum to a newborn is damn hard work, and we all need support. I am by no means and expert, but I am more than happy (and available) to be a supportive ear and shoulder xx

#26 Puggie

Puggie

    Part of the Furniture

  • ForumAddict
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 15,808 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 03:27 PM

Oh Stacey - I can hear the desperation in your posts sad.gif

I agree with a few of the other Mums here about wrapping and trying one routine. And if it helps, both of mine started to come good around 6 weeks and are now great sleepers - I hope the same happens with you.

Firstly is there anyone who can come and sit with Leo while you sleep? Anyone at all? If not family then friends? Early on with Oscar he just wanted to be cuddled and hubby and I were exhausted and then got sick. My MIL came over one Saturday and held him for 3 hours while we both slept. It really helped. A lot of people say "Oh I'd love to help" - this is the time to take them at their word. If you can't get a nanny in a hurry then perhaps even a local baby sitter?

Secondly have you looked at the routines in Save Our Sleep / The Contended Little Baby Book etc.? While I am not pushing all of their ideas, I found some of their ideas on sleep timing useful. E.g. up for an hour or so then attempt to put him down.

What I really found worked from their books was listening to the cries. We didn't do CC, but I did learn to listen to the difference between Oscar's 'cranky' cry and his 'distress' cry. Early on it can be hard to tell them apart - but the older they get the easier it gets.

With Oscar if he was tired he would do his cranky cry when put down - and it would escalate to the 'last hurrah' as I would call it (where he'd be quite grizzly) and then it would stop mid squark. And he'd be asleep. If I picked him up during cranky crying he would quieten, but would then be a nightmare to try and put back down.

Once I learned the difference between his cries I was able to leave him when he was grumbling, but go in immediately when he was distressed. Following the rough sleep times suggested, and then listening to the cries, worked for us with both kidlets.

#27 kisma

kisma

    Part of the Furniture

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,649 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 09:15 PM

QUOTE(SEA @ Jan 5 2012, 04:16 PM) View Post


YouTube Dunstan Baby Language and have a look at the different noises they make. 'Eh' is a windy noise, 'Na' is hungry, and 'Waa' is uncomfortable. It might seem a bit bogus, but it helped me recognise what both H and C were trying to 'tell' me.


I completely forgot about this AND I use it wacko.gif I found it too late with DS but it is very helpful with DD. I already knew and figured out the hungry cry but there are two wind cries, one for lower and one for upper. VERY helpful so you know when to get them up and burp them again.

I also agree that the max DD is up for (some days are exceptions to the rule, ie today rolleyes.gif ) is an hour, usually its only 40mins and she is back to sleep again.

I reckon get a night nanny in and try and see a chiro, unless your hubby feels like swapping for a while? (which I doubt)
<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb2f.lilypie....om/uBccp11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Second Birthday tickers" /></a>

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb1f.lilypie....om/d45Kp11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie First Birthday tickers" /></a>

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lbdf.lilypie....om/S5yfp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Pregnancy tickers" /></a>

#28 squeaza

squeaza

    The Artist Formerly Known as Anon-E-Mouse

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,361 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 10:12 PM

QUOTE(Puggie @ Jan 5 2012, 04:27 PM) View Post


What I really found worked from their books was listening to the cries. We didn't do CC, but I did learn to listen to the difference between Oscar's 'cranky' cry and his 'distress' cry. Early on it can be hard to tell them apart - but the older they get the easier it gets.

With Oscar if he was tired he would do his cranky cry when put down - and it would escalate to the 'last hurrah' as I would call it (where he'd be quite grizzly) and then it would stop mid squark. And he'd be asleep. If I picked him up during cranky crying he would quieten, but would then be a nightmare to try and put back down.



^^This for us too. We had a very tough time with day sleeps especially from 2-8 weeks, and I tried this and that and everything else and eventually accepted a certain amount of complaining, not out and out shrieking, but a good grizzle.

Definitely with our boy, us trying to 'intervene' at all just got him more worked up and awake, so patting or shushing or rocking or what have you didn't work at all. 15 months later, he's just about able to be popped down in his cot/room without the protest. He just wants to be up doing stuff, no matter how tired!

I don't have any advice better than what everyone else has said above.

Firstly sending you HUGE hugs. I wish I'd known - we were in Sydney last week and I could have easily come and given you a day or a half break so you could sleep.
<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb1f.lilypie....om/DHOwp11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie First Birthday tickers" /></a>



<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb3f.lilypie....om/NL93p11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Third Birthday tickers" /></a>


IPB Image

#29 Porthos

Porthos

    i-do Addict

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,963 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 10:14 PM

Jeepers sad.gif Stacey, how awful. You sound like you are at your wit's end and who can blame you? Sleep is a basic human need I am REVOLTING when I don't get enough: everything in my world very quickly turns to grey when I am sleep deprived. What you are describing is making me shudder.

I definitely second the other girls who suggested booking in for sleep school a.s.a.p and crying on the phone to them if you have to.

I have also heard of success stories when babies see chiros. He did have a tough birth and may have some aches and pains. Worth a shot?

QUOTE(la_jeune_mariée @ Jan 5 2012, 07:53 AM) View Post

I hadn't thought of the MCHN's. I'll call them today. I took him to the GP yesterday and it was the straw that broke the camels back. She cooed at him (he's a pretty chilled baby) and said "well he's clearly not distressed. If hes not distressed I'd leave him. Come back in 6 weeks if things aren't better and we can do something then". blink.gif

I'll look into a night nanny too. For some reason I thought they were just a kiwi thing. At least if we can just get a couple of nights rest we might be in a better place to asses what is going on. We have no support.


I almost cried when I read this...I'm hormonal, but I just feel so bad for you. That 'we have no support', it kills me sad.gif Can you call on friends? Even a friend who would sit with the baby for an hour? I have done this for a girlfriend of mine, I loved it, I got to sit there having divine cuddles whilst she got some shut eye - it was a delightful way of doing 'community service' as such.

FWIW I think Leo is incredibly overtired and over stimulated. I would be going the cry it out method - putting him down after a feed, burp and bath, wrapped tightly and walking away. It might take an hour or even two but I bet he'd cry himself off to sleep. Yes he's young, yes, it would be hard as hell...but it's already hard as hell and anything would be worth a shot. If Sam is doing so great he's happy to tell others about it, put him in charge / on guard whilst you either go and sleep or, if you can't manage that whilst your baby screams, you go for a walk or a chill in the back yard.

Admitedly we didn't start the CIO method until DD was 12 months and DS was about 5 months but it worked for both our kids and it was a hell of a lot faster than the CC method (for us). It's bloody hard but within nights we had success. I have never had to wait it out for more than 60 mins (because that's my limit, I can't let them go for more than an hour of crying...DH is tougher than me though) and usually with 20 mins they start slowly winding down / pausing which lets you know it's starting to work.

Good luck Stacey, thinking of you.


#30 goodgirl

goodgirl

    A grand adventure is about to begin...

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,280 posts

Posted 05 January 2012 - 10:14 PM

Ignore your husband and any "helpful" advice he'd like to give and get a night nanny. Everything will seem a whole lot better once you get some sleep. After you've refreshed you'll be able to deal with anything and can try things with a clear mind.

I have a swing that Lucas liked to sleep in in the early days which you can try if you don't have one. My sister used a vibrating bouncer on her daughter but L hated it. Different things work for different babies.

When Lucas was about 6 or 7 weeks old and I was having a melt down, my mum told me to go to her place and she'd help out for the night. DH made some stupid smart arse remark so I lost it, gave him the expressed bottles and the baby, told him good luck and went to my mums by myself. I got a good nights sleep and a very contrite and, from then on, understanding husband when I got home. Desperate times called for desperate measures.

If you need a break, like Naomi, I'm happy to come and watch or take Leo for a stroll for a few hours. I'm free tomorrow if you need a hand. smile.gif We've all been where you are and it is tough.

 <a href="http://lilypie.com/"><imgsrc="http://lb1f.lilypie.com/UMtzp11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie First Birthday tickers" /></a>

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><imgsrc="http://lpmf.lilypie.com/2Avip11.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Premature Baby tickers" /></a>




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users