Jump to content


Photo

Kittens - updated


  • Please log in to reply
124 replies to this topic

#16 Swarles Barkley

Swarles Barkley

    Legend-wait for it-dary!

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,067 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 09:42 AM

QUOTE(TrippyTaco @ Jan 20 2009, 10:03 AM) View Post

I'm not sure I agree. The kittens have been born because BL's cat had not been desexed so IMO it kind of is BL's reponsibility to make sure the same thing doesn't occur with these kittens. Does that make sense?


I get what you are saying, and in no way am i saying that BL's cat shouldnt have been desexed. But which would you rather, they were left in a cardboard box on the side of a road, or killed inhumanely (ie tied in a bag and drowned), or found new homes with new owners who will love them. Yes they shouldnt have been brought into the world, but things happen sometimes out of our control. Least BL is trying to do the right thing by these animals, and i highly doubt she would be willing to give them away to just anyone, without making sure they were responsible owners.





QUOTE(Lizzums @ Jan 20 2009, 10:26 AM) View Post

I agree.
Until someone has worked in a refuge and had to put down more then 50 kittens and cats a day over the xmas period I dont think they truely understand how terrible the situation is with "mistake" litters of puppies and kittens.
I believe that vets should be desexing puppies and kittens from 8 weeks or the appropriate weight (its been so long I cant remember now)

I am not exagerating with the number put down either... that was one refuge not a group just 1 refuge on any given day over the summer months... this is not include the puppies and adult dogs either.

If someone believes they have the right to bring baby animals into this world they have the responsibility to ensure that these babies do not make more babies of their own.
This is what should really happen. The pregnancy should be aborted as soon as possible.
Animals are not like people. They do not NEED to have babies. Its because people can not handle the pregancy being aborted that so many kittens and puppies are born.


Liz, i am unsure if you are speaking in general, or about BL's cat/kittens specifically. Yes there are people who do the wrong thing, just like there are shit people in the world who do the wrong thing. But least BL is taking some responsiblity for her cats actions and not just leaving them at a shelter/killing them
<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb1f.lilypie....om/IXnfp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie First Birthday tickers" /></a>

#17 rachealD

rachealD

    i-do Addict

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,264 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 09:48 AM

QUOTE(Lizzums @ Jan 20 2009, 10:26 AM) View Post

I agree.
Until someone has worked in a refuge and had to put down more then 50 kittens and cats a day over the xmas period I dont think they truely understand how terrible the situation is with "mistake" litters of puppies and kittens.
I believe that vets should be desexing puppies and kittens from 8 weeks or the appropriate weight (its been so long I cant remember now)


I have to agree with this 100%, the kitten only needs to be 1Kg to be desexed and this happens at around 8 weeks, if they are healthy.

I have no doubt that BL had no intention of getting her cat pregnant, I am sure that she is caring for them and doing everything she can for them. BUT, by rehoming them undesexed, she is fueling the problem. It is her responsibility because it is her cat. her responsibility does not end with finding them good homes...or atleast should not.
IPB Image



If you dont stand for something, you will fall for anything
"Saving just one dog won't change the world, but
it surely will change the world for that one dog."
Edmund Burke

Posted Imagehttp://i72.photobuck...ws/Silver-1.gif[/img]

#18 lizzums

lizzums

    Part of the Furniture

  • ForumAddict
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,485 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 09:51 AM

QUOTE(Liberarchi @ Jan 20 2009, 09:34 AM) View Post

Bec's vet refused to terminate, beacause of the distress it would cause the staff. dry.gif ALthought if they had I wouldn't have my little Kitty Kitty wub.gif

What if Becs cat had been unwell and the birth could have killed her what would the vets staff done then? What a tosser that vet is.

QUOTE(april_candice @ Jan 20 2009, 09:42 AM) View Post

Liz, i am unsure if you are speaking in general, or about BL's cat/kittens specifically. Yes there are people who do the wrong thing, just like there are shit people in the world who do the wrong thing. But least BL is taking some responsiblity for her cats actions and not just leaving them at a shelter/killing them

But them going to homes not desexed can cause more pregnancies.
I am just very very passionate about this because I have dealt with the "but we were doing the right thing by saving the kitten" influx of new kittens. People seem to assume because they are only having one litter that it is not affecting anything but it is and it does.
Yes they may be going to good homes but how many will then maybe have "accidental" pregnancies?
All rescue groups must including the smaller ones ensure that any cats or kittens that they rehome go with vaccinations and desexed to ensure that in the future they may no be quite so busy with rescues. If people hunt around they can find a vet who will desex earlier and I know in QLD you cant but in other States the RSPCA will do the desexing (well they used to) for the general public.

#19 rachealD

rachealD

    i-do Addict

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,264 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 09:57 AM

QUOTE(Lizzums @ Jan 20 2009, 10:51 AM) View Post

All rescue groups must including the smaller ones ensure that any cats or kittens that they rehome go with vaccinations and desexed to ensure that in the future they may no be quite so busy with rescues. If people hunt around they can find a vet who will desex earlier and I know in QLD you cant but in other States the RSPCA will do the desexing (well they used to) for the general public.


In Victoria, ALL animals rehomed by a shelter or a rescue group MUST be desexed, to my knowledge this is a legal requirement. Also pounds will not release to rescue without the animal being desexed. All animals rehomed by a shelter and rescue are vaccinated as well.

Liz, once again, you have put very eloquently what I have been trying to say. I totally agree with you.
IPB Image



If you dont stand for something, you will fall for anything
"Saving just one dog won't change the world, but
it surely will change the world for that one dog."
Edmund Burke

Posted Imagehttp://i72.photobuck...ws/Silver-1.gif[/img]

#20 Swarles Barkley

Swarles Barkley

    Legend-wait for it-dary!

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,067 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 09:59 AM

Liz are you saying i am not caring because i would rather see a kitten rehomed and be desexed by its new owner, than have it killed before it was born?

You're arguement seems to be based on the 'what if's'. Well what if you were to have a child that turned into a mass murderer. should that mean that everyone should be made infertile at birth? What if all of the kittens go to loving homes and are desexed?

What i am trying to say is that give it a rest, yes her cat had kittens, no-one can turn back time and stop that. But least she is trying to do something with them now, and not just taking the easy road and leaving them at a shelter. God, i have seen kittens rehomed many times on this forum, and its never been such an issue before.
<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lb1f.lilypie....om/IXnfp10.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie First Birthday tickers" /></a>

#21 Decembergirl

Decembergirl

    So this is how it's done!

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,660 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 10:06 AM

Liz I agree with you in principle but I think you and others have missed an important point here. BL is rehoming the kittens herself, not via a shelter. Therefore she'd be out of pocket for the cost of seven (six kittens and the mother cat) de-sexing operations. That would be in excess of $1000. Personally I'd rather she find the kittens homes (as she's doing) and take care of the mother cat's de-sexing. I say I'd rather that, as I know that faced with a $1000 + de-sexing bill many people (not suggesting BL would, but other uncaring owners) would "dispose" of the kittens in an inhumane way if they were forced to de-sex before rehoming.

Also, BL I think you're doing a good thing in finding them loving homes and for that I'm sure the kitties and their new owners thank you.
Sometimes in an ordinary life, love gives us a fairytale...

IPB Image

<a href="http://www.thebump.com/?utm_source=ticker&utm_medium=HTML&utm_campaign=tickers" title="Getting Pregnant"><img src="http://global.thebump.com/tickers/tt10d506.aspx" alt=" Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker" border="0" /></a>

<a href="http://www.thebump.com/?utm_source=ticker&utm_medium=HTML&utm_campaign=tickers" title="Parenting Tips"><img src="http://global.thebump.com/tickers/tt1b0910.aspx" alt=" Pregnancy Ticker" border="0" /></a>

My blog!

#22 tianakaesha

tianakaesha

    Token Urban Hippy

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,637 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 10:15 AM

They could be surrendered to a shelter and be desexed and rehomed (or put to sleep depending on how many others are trying for homes at the same time)
They could be desexed through a cat shelter program (Cat protection sydney do this) at a reduced rate and then instead of being free to good home, a fee charged to cover all costs ($100 for desexing, worming and vax for example). You'd be surprised at how many people would choose this option because it is something they don't have to do later
They can be rehomed for a fee ofr $100 and the owners get that money back when the animals are desexed.

There are options... but free to good home sounds much more appealing.
IPB Image

#23 rachealD

rachealD

    i-do Addict

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,264 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 10:21 AM

This thread is making me extremely sad and I am trying desperately to not get emotional, but its hard when I have 2 kittens at home after being dumped because of an "accident" ( I was in the shelter when they came in)

I am not sure whether we realise the extent of this problem.
IPB Image



If you dont stand for something, you will fall for anything
"Saving just one dog won't change the world, but
it surely will change the world for that one dog."
Edmund Burke

Posted Imagehttp://i72.photobuck...ws/Silver-1.gif[/img]

#24 *Lib**

*Lib**

    Part of the Furniture

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,652 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 10:30 AM

I doubt this is about the cats......... laugh.gif
IPB Image
A & L 10.05.2003
S 30.09.2004

<a href="http://www.TickerFactory.com/weight-loss/wLhwRy1/">
<img border="0" src="http://tickers.TickerFactory.com/ezt/t/wLhwRy1/s-weight.png"></a>


#25 rachealD

rachealD

    i-do Addict

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,264 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 10:34 AM

QUOTE(Liberarchi @ Jan 20 2009, 11:30 AM) View Post

I doubt this is about the cats......... laugh.gif


Im confused, if its not then what is it about? I am certainly talking about cats.
IPB Image



If you dont stand for something, you will fall for anything
"Saving just one dog won't change the world, but
it surely will change the world for that one dog."
Edmund Burke

Posted Imagehttp://i72.photobuck...ws/Silver-1.gif[/img]

#26 *Lib**

*Lib**

    Part of the Furniture

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,652 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 10:49 AM

QUOTE(Chrissy25 @ Jan 20 2009, 10:34 AM) View Post

Im confused, if its not then what is it about? I am certainly talking about cats.

Chrissy - Meet Bronnylee. ph34r.gif
IPB Image
A & L 10.05.2003
S 30.09.2004

<a href="http://www.TickerFactory.com/weight-loss/wLhwRy1/">
<img border="0" src="http://tickers.TickerFactory.com/ezt/t/wLhwRy1/s-weight.png"></a>


#27 Leapstar

Leapstar

    AKA - ~*Alias*~

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,163 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 10:53 AM

In regards to this issue I can really see both sides.

People like Chrissy who so obviously care a great deal about animal welfare have nothing but my eternal admiration and I applaude her actions as she does wonderful things.

Having said that from an average lay persons POV, I have always loved and had cats as pets, but everything I ever heard from vets etc read in cat care books, was desexing at 5-6 months old. When we got our old family cat from the Cat Protection Society about 17 years ago (and she is still with us) we were allowed to take her home straight away at 8 weeks without being desexed, we paid for the desxing up front and were required to take her back to the affiliated vets for desexing at 5 months.

Until I read it here on these forums I was not aware that cats could be dexed so young. As the average responsible cat owner I took my current cat and had her vaccinated as a kitten and arranged with my vet to have her desexed at 5 months on the vets advice. I think that most people who are not as intimate or educated as the likes of Chrissy and Lizzums in regards to the age of desexing issue would take the advice of their vet and have thier pet desexed at the vets recommended age. I do not think that its fair to criticise or judge the OP for doing the right thing as per her vets advice. She was trying to get her cat desexed when she found out she was pregnant, she is trying to find loving homes for the resulting kittens and did not cruelly or callously dump them. I think that she has done her best and if you think she was wrong maybe educate but dont berate!!

For my own further curiosity, if the shelters etc are advocating desexing from around 10 weeks, why is this not recommended by vets??

IPB Image
Merry Christmas!!

#28 rachealD

rachealD

    i-do Addict

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,264 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 11:05 AM

QUOTE(Leapstar @ Jan 20 2009, 11:53 AM) View Post

In regards to this issue I can really see both sides.

People like Chrissy who so obviously care a great deal about animal welfare have nothing but my eternal admiration and I applaude her actions as she does wonderful things.

Having said that from an average lay persons POV, I have always loved and had cats as pets, but everything I ever heard from vets etc read in cat care books, was desexing at 5-6 months old. When we got our old family cat from the Cat Protection Society about 17 years ago (and she is still with us) we were allowed to take her home straight away at 8 weeks without being desexed, we paid for the desxing up front and were required to take her back to the affiliated vets for desexing at 5 months.

Until I read it here on these forums I was not aware that cats could be dexed so young. As the average responsible cat owner I took my current cat and had her vaccinated as a kitten and arranged with my vet to have her desexed at 5 months on the vets advice. I think that most people who are not as intimate or educated as the likes of Chrissy and Lizzums in regards to the age of desexing issue would take the advice of their vet and have thier pet desexed at the vets recommended age. I do not think that its fair to criticise or judge the OP for doing the right thing as per her vets advice. She was trying to get her cat desexed when she found out she was pregnant, she is trying to find loving homes for the resulting kittens and did not cruelly or callously dump them. I think that she has done her best and if you think she was wrong maybe educate but dont berate!!

For my own further curiosity, if the shelters etc are advocating desexing from around 10 weeks, why is this not recommended by vets??


Thanks Leapstar smile.gif

I agree with you about misinformation out there even among vets and this has resulted in situations similar to this. TBH I am not sure why vets recommend this to their clients.

Like I have said in previous posts, I am sure she is doing the best she can, all I am saying is that this is the situation that is repeated over and over during kitten season. All I am asking and hoping for is she take responsibility for the situation and have her kittens desexed before she rehomes them, if she is going to cover this by an adoption fee, that is up to her.

Like tianakaesha said, there are options, and lot of shelters will let you pay it off over time.

I am not trying to berate her not at all.


QUOTE(Liberarchi @ Jan 20 2009, 11:49 AM) View Post

Chrissy - Meet Bronnylee. ph34r.gif


Well if nothing else I hope that this thread helps someone in the future. It has some very valuable information in it.

IPB Image



If you dont stand for something, you will fall for anything
"Saving just one dog won't change the world, but
it surely will change the world for that one dog."
Edmund Burke

Posted Imagehttp://i72.photobuck...ws/Silver-1.gif[/img]

#29 Bruce

Bruce

    Part of the Furniture

  • avid user
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,185 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 11:29 AM

QUOTE(Lizzums @ Jan 20 2009, 09:26 AM) View Post


Animals are not like people. They do not NEED to have babies.



I don't quite understand this statement.


#30 lizzums

lizzums

    Part of the Furniture

  • ForumAddict
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,485 posts

Posted 20 January 2009 - 12:09 PM

QUOTE(Bruce @ Jan 20 2009, 11:29 AM) View Post

I don't quite understand this statement.

I meant in the emotive sense. People are continually putting human emotions onto animals. Yes animals have emotions but not in the same way that we as people have them.
Also not saying that all people feel the need to have a child either.
Guess I am just confusing myself now. Its been an emotional day.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users